They Survived Addiction. Now They’re Saving Lives.
Brandon, Founder and Clinical Director of Southern Pines, survived years of IV heroin and meth addiction. Emily, Lead Therapist at Southern Pines lived as a functioning alcoholic, holding together a career and family while quietly falling apart. Before helping others find healing, both fought their own battles with addiction. In this episode, they share the moments that nearly cost them their lives. Brandon recounts surviving a near-fatal overdose. Emily shares what it was like to enter treatment and discover she was pregnant.
Together, they discuss what finally led them to recovery, how addiction impacts families, and why recovery is about more than simply getting sober. They also share the heart behind Southern Pines Recovery, an outpatient recovery center in Evans, Georgia that helps individuals and families take the first steps toward lasting healing. Whether you're struggling yourself or supporting someone you love, this conversation is a reminder that recovery is possible. To learn more about Southern Pines Recovery or connect with their team, visit the links below.
Connect with Southern Pines Recovery Website: https://southernpinesrecovery.com/
Email: info@southernpinesrecovery.com
Phone Number: 706-534-2567
Socials: @southernpinesrecovery
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Hey, thanks for joining us on the Recovery Valve podcast. Today I'm going to be spending some time with Emily and Brandon from Southern Pines Recovery.
They are based right here in Evans, Georgia, and they talk about what they do as clinicians in their outpatient treatment program. Now, you'll also hear their stories a little bit. We dive into that, but I think this episode is going to be one that we can all learn from. So, sit back, relax, and enjoy today's episode.
[music]
On today's episode of the Recovery Val Podcast, I have a returning podcast guest, Brandon. Thanks so much for coming back. You and your wife came on the podcast last year and we talked about everything from substance addiction to process addiction, but what I really enjoyed was your wife having the courage to come out and talk about food addiction, which she was the very first woman to come on the podcast and talk about that. So, thank you for coming back.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
And Miss Emily, thank you so much for coming on the podcast with Brandon. And you two are going to do this for me, okay? and we'll walk you through some conversation and we're going to get to Southern Pines's recovery and everything that you guys offer, but Brandon, you told us a little bit before when you were here kind of your story. So, remind us of the type of recovery you were in and how long maybe you were in addiction, how you got to recover, what do you do to stay in recovery, and then Miss Emily, I'll shift it to you. You can I just want everybody to hear a little bit of background on who you are and what got you to where you are and how you want to serve people.
Yeah. I mean, I started using at sixth grade, seventh grade.
Do you remember the first thing you tried?
Yeah, alcohol. Alcohol. I was 11 years old. It was vodka and coke uh stolen from my aunt and uncle's little uh liquor bottle with my cousin. And I don't remember much from that experience, but the next time was in seventh grade at grade. I drank by myself as a 13-year-old. Again, stole it from my parents like playing Excite Bike on Nintendo and just said, "You know what?" went to the neighborhood pool and drank. Went to the pool. Was pretty buzzed. Thought I was cooler than I'd ever been. Thought the girls thought I was hotter than I'd ever been. I don't know if they did, but uh [laughter] I doubt it, but I thought they thought that I was. And yeah, it was it was magic. The magic happened at 13. And it was like, dang, I want to do that again. Yeah. Uh, and it that carried into, you know, to to really sum up a lot of years, it was about I was 33, 32 when I got sober and it turned into a IV, heroin, and meth addiction.
At the end of it, you were on Yep. brought me to my knees.
I forgot that. I didn't know that you'd got into IV heroin.
Mhm. Yeah. And, uh, my fourth time in treatment, uh, I was, you know, open and heard the message of recovery through, uh, uh, 12 steps and through the big book of Alcott Anonymous. it and it it broke me wide open, changed my relationship with Jesus, changed my relationship with myself and everybody around me. And from 6 months into being uh sober, I've worked and served in some capacity in the recovery field. It's all I've done since I got sober.
When you think back and and if this is too traumatic, you don't have to.
No, not at [snorts] all. Um the scariest time that you can remember right now, I know there's probably a bunch, but the scariest time ever on um IV heroin or you know shooting up heroin. What was the scariest time you remember?
So it's in the moment it it wasn't that scary, but I recall two specific situations. One where I had woke up, I came to and my jaw had locked up. I had bit dang near bit through my lip and I pretty much about died from an overdose. but I didn't and I was alone.
Uh and that could have easily been the end uh of my time here. The other was I I vaguely remember being carried around by some girl I didn't really know who they told me had kept me from dying from an overdose. Uh, and so those two things stick out to me that that those could have easily been my end and my parents forever tragedy that they had to deal with and for whatever reason the grace of God unlike so many others sadly have not had that.
I I survived uh you those situations and was able to proceed forward with life.
Yeah. No, that's good. I I asked that because I want people when they hear this, you know, a lot of times people want to hear just get to the topic of the conversation. And I I don't I don't mind doing that, but I want people to see the information is coming from somebody that went through something and had a a hard time, you know, before you got to the point of of being of service. Yeah. You know what I mean?
Yeah. Yeah. Greatest asset is is all that is my that's my greatest asset to be in this field now is everything that I went through up to this point.
How long you been in recovery now? uh July 1st, you know, Lord willing, will be 12 years.
So 11 years and however many nine months till something like that.
Yeah. We start rounding up once you get to a certain [laughter] certain amount of years like it's 700 months.
Yeah. [laughter] Lot of a lot of days, a lot of hours where it was unfathomable to go hours truly hours without it. I couldn't I couldn't make it hours. And now we're talking years.
Yeah. Yeah, I had lunch with a guy on Friday who's who's still out there and he's like I was like, "Man, if you can just not after we eat lunch, if you can go through this afternoon, just get to maybe tonight um and text me or call me." He's like hours. No, that [clears throat] won't happen. Probably not.
It's not going to happen.
It's a hard thing for people to grasp when unless you've been in it is I mean I've had families do a practice where I'll ask them to hold their breath in a in a group setting. I'll be like, "Hold your breath.
Keep holding it. Keep holding it. keep holding it. Eventually, you know what's gonna happen? They're gonna breathe. And whether they want to breathe or not, they'll start ah, [gasps]
you know, like, okay, so why couldn't you keep holding your breath? Why were you not able to hold your breath and be like, cuz your body and your brain said you had to breathe regardless of whether you wanted to or not. Welcome to an addict's mind in the grips of addiction. Whether they want to use or not, the brain says breathe, which equates to use.
Yeah. I had to take a deep breath when you were doing that. [laughter] You know, yeah, it's involuntary and and and for us in it, when we're in it this hard once we're given a window of grace, which a lot of us are, now it's on us.
We're responsible to act in that window and and pursue recovery. But until then, the powerlessness is real. Yeah. And it sucks.
Yeah.
So, appreciate you being here again.
Yeah. Absolutely. [clears throat] And I can't wait to talk more about this, but first, I want to talk to Miss Emily. Emily, thank you so much for coming and joining us on the podcast.
I'm so sorry. My chairs suck. [laughter] They don't. They do. They really do. It's not just right for these chairs.
No, you shouldn't. I should have been thinking about that when I got them. I'm like, "Oh, these are ergonomic. Doctors use them. These will be great, but they're not good.
Sitting on a saddle." So, [laughter] it is. It is like sitting on a saddle.
Um, [laughter] thank you so much for coming.
Well, I'm happy to be here and being on this podcast. We're going to talk about a lot of stuff, but before we talk about a lot of stuff, I want to hear from you kind of the same concept like what got you into recovery. Tell us, you know, what your addiction was and and the hardest day in addiction before you found recovery, maybe.
Okay, great. Um, I'm a recovering alcoholic. Um, I I guess a little different in my story. You know, you hear a lot of people talk about their first use or drink, whatever it was. um that it being this overwhelming sense of relief or sense of euphoria like I've always supposed to do this and I don't remember feeling that way. I feel like I think I was in ninth grade and it was more like you know I had two older brothers and they drank in high school and you know TV and movies high schoolers drink and it's just what you do when you get to high school.
Yeah. We hide it in the woods and go get it later. Yeah. That's that's just what high that's what teenagers do of course.
Um so that's really how I started. And then I did actually have a real spiritual experience through my church
in high school and and really came to know Jesus at that time. And I quit drinking. And not because anybody told me to, not because I'd gotten in trouble or had a problem or that they were even talking to these high school sophomores at this retreat about it. I don't think they knew they needed to. Um, but I just came home and knew that that this relationship with Jesus was the most important thing to me and that I I that drinking was going to get in the way of that. I just knew that.
How deep into your drinking were you?
I'd probably only been drinking about a year. And then you were in high school. I was in high school. Okay. So I was like 15. It was in 10th grade.
Um and I stayed with that throughout high school. Um and then I went to college and what started out as just kind of social drinking um escalated a little and then following a traumatic experience in college, it just really I just really went off the rails. Um, I did manage to kind of keep it together for a long time. What does that mean?
I, Right. Well, I paid my bills. I had a job. I, um, had relationships. I didn't get married until later. But throughout my 20s, I, you know, I wasn't living in Augusta, so my parents didn't see a lot of what I was doing.
There was no uh, life 360, right, where we can track our kids or No. So, as far as they knew, like I said, I wasn't asking to borrow money. I wasn't getting arrested. I managed to not get in any trouble. Um, so, so that's what I mean by kind of managed for a while. And then I got married at 31 and had a child right away. And
I kind of kept it together actually right after she was born. And the next year got pregnant again. And following the birth of my second child, the combination of having white knuckled because I was I mean I was a full-blown alcoholic before I got pregnant the first time. It was it was difficult to white knuckle my way through pregnancies, but I was like I'm not going to.
And you did it right. But I managed to do it through my pregnancies.
And then I think the weight of white knuckling for those years in addition to some postpartum depression, I just fell apart completely. I mean, it was it got bad fast. Um, my husband had no idea what to do with me.
I mean, I was I was a mess. Um, did you say your husband was in recovery, too?
No. Well, I'm I'm engaged to somebody else now. My my marriage [laughter] my [clears throat] um marriage did not survive. It actually survived through that, but once I got sober, I realized some things that he needed to work on, and it just it didn't work out. But I am now engaged to somebody who's also in recovery and is a wonderful partner and um co-parent to my children. Um did the same thing. I was I was married before and Okay.
She was my drug buddy, drinking buddy buddies now, right?
But we just co-parent, right? That's what we did together for fun, right? We were Yeah. That's what we had in common.
Yeah. Did you pick up the 12-pack on the way home? No. But I will. But I will.
Or the 18 pack and the case, [laughter] right? The handle, whatever the case may be. Right. Um, so at any rate, that was I went to treatment and while I was in treatment, this is I don't know why I always feel the need to tell this part. Um, you know, as a woman, when you check into treatment, they give everybody a pregnancy test, okay? And mine was negative, but a week later, I walked back into that nurse's station and I said, "Y'all need to do another one of those." I was just so newly pregnant that it wasn't registering yet. So, I found out I was pregnant with my third child while I was treat while I was in treatment. You know what I was thinking about when you were talking about white knuckling it with the first two pregnancies is I wonder why you couldn't find sobriety then because you know you pushed through like you know well but you probably didn't work a step program or something like that you know so right I didn't do anything about it was just like okay I'm you know I'm having this baby I need to do this you know um I also think even though I clearly had a drinking problem it's like you said my partner was my drinking buddy And um I don't think I think everybody thought I just needed to grow up a little bit and pull back a little. Nobody was suggesting looking back I know it but at the time nobody was even suggesting that I was a full-blown alcoholic and needed
to go to treatment because like I said I managed to keep things looking okay.
Did they treat you different when they found out you were pregnant in recovery?
Because I don't know if I've ever never heard that kind of a story before.
Um what happens when they when you tell them, "Hey, I'm" and you well it comes back that you're pregnant. What happens?
I don't know if anyone treated me differently there. I do actually think there were a couple of staff members who were extra nice to me, like really wanted to be supportive.
I got really angry.
Not about being pregnant, just about I I I I can't explain it exactly, but we've all, I'm sure, know stories about people who in treatment just get overcome with I just was angry. I was just angry at the whole thing. I was angry that my husband was so angry with me. I was I was just Yeah.
And I wanted to say because I had done it with the first two, I'm pregnant. I'm not going to drink. Just let me go home.
[laughter]
Yeah. It's like stages of grief, emotional roller coasters and different Exactly. I got in that spot with it. Um, but to kind of back up to answer the
question before I went, the scariest thing was to me what made me finally decide to go was what if I accidentally harm one of my children? You know, what or what if I harm these relationships? You know, what if my children are going to want nothing to do with me? Um, that's that's what
scared me into getting help because like I said, I just always landed on my feet.
I never got a DUI. I never got, you know, in a terrible financial situation.
I'd always So, it was it was realizing, okay, I'm a mother, which I've always wanted to be, and I'm really, really screwing this up.
Yeah.
You know, and I'm sure that was coming if you, if you'd stayed out there, you' got you got a DUI. some other things probably could have happened. But I might I would have had kids that didn't talk to me or you know that was a big fear for a long time even into sobriety. That was kind of um you know we always talk about you do and you do you need to be happy with yourself. You need to be in recovery for yourself and motivated by that. But um my children and those precious relationships are what kept me motivated on the days that I didn't love myself enough to do it for sure.
That's really good. If you think back though to that time, uh what was the scariest or most traumatic that you would want to share on a podcast for for the world to hear uh in in your addiction before you found recovery?
Anything that like Brandon, you know, woke up alone? So, um I did and this is just a small I mean there's there's a lot of things that were just generally happened that were um bad feelings like I frequently I was a blackout drinker so I woke up often times not knowing what had happened and that's a scary thing in general if it's like I don't know how I I don't know whose house this is you know [laughter] there um when I was younger or if it was the car or Right. Or even in in my 30s when I would wake up, you know, in my own home, but still like I don't my husband and I have a fight last night. Did I call somebody? Did I, you know, who's mad at me?
Yeah. I used to like to do that when I was drinking. I would like to call people. What you up to? Family or stuff like that.
Think of the destruction people can cause to their life without ever leaving the house with social media. Being drunken like that. Oh, I'm imagining
that if we had social media back when I stopped drinking, I would have been a keyboard pirate. Bubba, [laughter] I hate you so much right now. You know what I mean? These messages are very indicative of where someone is. You're like, "Oh no, they're not well right now. Oh, this ain't good." But there was one story that I'll tell.
And it was just again, it was just not a thing that really happened. just like what could have happened in this situation where it was when I was living in Florida and I was walking back to a friend's house.
That was the plan that I was going to stay at her house that night. Um, but I was by myself for whatever reason. I don't know if we were just meeting there. I I don't recall the details. I don't recall this walk home, but another friend came upon me and there was like I was being followed by two men like down a dark side street. And if a friend of mine had not seen this happen and gotten me to our friend's house safely, could have been bad, right? Yeah. Could have never heard from me again.
And I don't remember that. You know, I was completely vulnerable, completely helpless. And that was a state I chose to get myself in over and over again.
You know, I used to blackout drink, too. And just so we can relate, um, one story I was thinking about when you guys were talking was, uh, the first time I got a DUI, I remember wrecking my truck on I20 and I, my kid, my oldest kid was a baby then. He was still in a car seat and I remember seeing the car seat on the side road and I knew that I had him with me that morning because I was supposed to supposed to pick him up.
Um, but at some point um, because I love to drink in the morning.
Mhm. And I would I would be drunk, not all to the point of blackout, but just from being in the accident. I I didn't I couldn't recognize everything that was going on. And when I saw the car seat, I was like, I've I've killed my kid. Oh gosh.
Um but luckily enough, I had dropped him off um with a babysitter and just forgot about it. Oh my gosh.
And that was Yeah, it was it was terrifying. And then you know the thoughts or and the times I tried to hurt myself. That was some of the scariest moments is you know being alone or waking up alone or trying to go to sleep and being alone and never waking up again. Those are just scary times. Um so enough about that.
Let's uh let's shift gears a little bit.
One thing that you both said that well and I hear this from a lot of guests when they come on is you know I started drinking. I was uh you know 13 years old or whatever. From a clinical point of view, from a I have a female and a male here together. Clinically, is there a reason that we choose to drink at that age? Does something click or happen? Um, I want to use this as we bridge into, you know, talking about Southern Pines, but what do you think goes on in in a in a adolescent mind that says, I'm going to do this, and does it unlock the addiction, do you think?
Wow. Uh, what a what a question that I don't have a a 100% answer for. I can just think of sometimes it's it's experiential. There is trauma that's occurred that kind of you know folks are at a young age trying to escape what they don't realize they're trying to escape. Uh, I know for me it was I was more just attracted to the like I the appeal of drugs and alcohol and it it cool rock stars made it look cool and for some reason I think I was and I do believe it's genetic. There's a gen genetic component to it and I was genetically uh predisposed to it and it just always had an appeal to me. cigarettes and alcohol and rock and roll just looked cool and I wanted and when I felt it, it just did something. I don't know why there's so why so many other people have the experience um you know the changes that occur at that age where we start to develop our own personalities trying to find our own way. A lot of the the subconscious unconscious fears that are starting to show up of insecurity, I'm not good enough. You hear a lot of people, I didn't feel like I felt, you know, I didn't was I didn't feel right in my own skin or something along those lines. You know what I'm talking about?
The the I wasn't comfortable in my own skin. I think that starts early. Uh and and it appears to be an out uh although not always driven by some sort of traumatic event, just a wiring that exists up to that point.
Did you have something traumatic happen to you before the age of I did? I did. I had some sexual uh stuff going on from a male uh adult male uh in ages four to six years. You can remember that?
I do. I do remember it. I And so and I don't I would have told you it didn't affect me well into adult years and I don't mind sharing that. Like I've shared that from a podium. I share it with anyone who ever wants to know. It's so it's so common unfortunately. Uh and it's something that that the more people are willing to talk about the freer they can get. M I don't I don't blame that.
It's an experience I [clears throat] had. I don't ever recall thinking like, gosh, I feel I feel, you know, flawed or imperfect or or, you know, unworthy.
Therefore, I'm going to soothe this with alcohol. I just wanted to be cool. I mean, really, it was a desire to be cool
and and alcohol at an early age had some sort of cool attachment to it, and I just wanted to be cool and liked and popular.
Yeah, I I agree. I totally agree with that. I I just wondered if there was some kind of formula that that people in that your world have put together that
says, "Well, this trauma happened and by the time you get to this age, this is when you're trying to start bury that trauma." Does that make sense? Cuz the same thing happened to me. But I wasn't necessarily trying to bury the trauma. I was trying to forget it. It wasn't like I was hurt by it. I mean, I knew it was wrong when she was doing it. Mhm.
Um but it it skewered my my perception of what something is supposed to be nice and pretty and all that kind of stuff.
She removed that. And so yeah, it it goes back to um and I I sound so preachy when I say this. I don't mean to be, but it you have to guard. That's why we guard want to guard our kids so much is because we're trying to protect them from from these kind of things, especially us that have gone through that kind of trauma. Do you have anything that you would say that makes this equal this because of this?
I don't think that there is a formula. I don't think that um you know I do think that oftentimes people um who have addiction have experienced trauma often times early. Um but there's also plenty of people who have had the same traumatic event who aren't addicts.
So I don't think that there is a timeline there. I think honestly a lot to do with the reason that we see that 13 14 age is genuinely just a matter of access. That's the about the age where you start being able to you've got that older sibling or that messed up uncle who's like well they're in high school now. I think that it's just that age where a lot of us I think do have kind of what Brandon talked about this innate kind of whether it's just a restlessness or just an intrigue or I think it was too like what can I do to get and get away with it right that's a drug for me absolutely boy was it a drug for me was how much can I do without anybody without getting caught oh my gosh I I did that well into my 30s when I finally got sober there was this element of oh can I get away with this you know no one's going to notice Um, but I do think that we see that age so often just because it's our parents are giving us a little more freedom.
Maybe we have some older friends. It really is just a matter of access and then we just really dig in from there. Yeah.
You know, that's good. How you doing on my doctor chair? I'm fine. I figured it out. Okay. Yeah, I figured out a good balance.
[laughter]
We are not sponsored by these chairs, but I'm glad I'm glad you're making it.
All right. So, let's shift a little bit because we got time. Um, I've heard from both of you. You guys did great. Thanks for sharing that. I mean, you did really
good. Um, not that you're being graded, but let's talk about how you are using your past and your trauma and your addiction to now you are helping people in not only your own recovery because for me like helping people is how I stay in sobriety. Sure.
To an extent.
Um, but how are you guys at Southern Pines Recovery doing that? And what does Southern Pines offer people? you you told me in the beginning of the of the show, but if if you're telling this to to people that may hear it and they pick up the phone and call you guys, what are they going to expect?
So, I'll I'll just kind of walk briefly through I started my journey as a house manager. Well, actually, first as an office assistant at the facility I was at working for paying to work basically, you know, I was still a resident. They asked me to work in the office.
Moved into a house manager role. Moved in went to grad school, got a master's degree in social work. All this came after getting sober. Like a whole purpose.
Yeah. A lot of doors started open.
Showed up when I got sober and God was like, "This is what you're supposed to do. I want you out here helping people do, you know, what you've been helped to do, which is find freedom and peace." And so it turned into a master's degree, turned a recovery coach, worked as a therapist at an intensive outpatient program, moved here, worked at the Bluff, uh, which is our one of our local facilities in Augustus, great program.
um worked as a case manager, therapist, clinical director, moved into private practice for about two years. And this idea came about in the midst of well, it came about probably prior to me leaving Bluff, but in the midst of private
practice, uh I knew I wanted to open my own mind and God's own facility. Uh, and
I talked to a buddy of mine who and we we concluded that basically Augusta did not have this level of care that
Southern Pines offers and it was a gap in availability for our community. And explain the gap. What does that mean?
So, basically what we do, Southern Pines Recovery is an outpatient detox facility. So, someone who either I'll I'll usually phrase it like this, who either can't go inatient, meaning leave their life, leave their home, separate from their responsibilities. They either can't or there's a lot of us out there that won't. They're like, I'm not doing that. I don't need all that, but I'm willing to go to this place. It's like that we're the beginning stages of their recovery journey. It's, you know, the wife is saying, "You need to go." Or the husband's saying, "You got to do
something." They're like, "I won't go anywhere.
We're the we're like the thing [laughter] that that was a great impression of somebody.
A lot of them. I ain't doing that. I don't need it. [laughter] Yeah. Uh we are the thing that the wife or husband or or or family member can go, how about this? Yeah.
Can we start here? And we basically someone who would who would have withdrawal symptoms from substances being substance dependent whether they're full-blown addict, alcoholic or dependent from medications a doc gave them and truly don't suffer from the addiction illness but need medical help to come off of the substance. We do that on an outpatient basis, meaning they come from their home or their stable living environment every day, see us, receive medical care, assessments, medication is a part of it, not as a long-term usually, but as a short-term deal, and we ease them down through the withdrawal symptoms. And then that's not all that happens. They get to meet with Emily. I'm a licensed clinician. Emily's a licensed, associate licensed clinician. They get family recovery support. They get family therapy sessions. They get group therapy sessions. They get individual therapy sessions all while they're in our care.
And and we're basically, you know, from a 12step perspective, we're trying to 12step them to get into the practices of what actually keeps people sober long term.
It's very practical. People miss over complicate the practicality. Absolutely. This is not rocket science.
Like we learned how to move our feet with some basic disciplines of life and and things change.
I love that. rapidly a lot of times and it's kind of I know it's kind of hybrid because did you say that they're you're doing calls with them like while they're at home too and and they come to see you. So, no, they're they're they're going to receive their career while they're on our, you know, on our property in our facility daily. And that could look like, you know, the first day, the first day of admission, it's a pretty long assessment type day, four to five hours. Second day, it's going to be about three hours. Then from there, we're going to anticipate having them about an hour depending on what they're doing that day. their first stop when they get there is see our one of our registered nurses, get their vitals checked, be assessed, [snorts] you know, conclude how they did
the last 24 hours. Um, you know, notice any needs uh for adjustments with their medications. Uh they'll meet with with our RN and then they'll typically they're, you know, once they've received medications, they need to be monitored.
We got to make sure they're not having any adverse reactions. During that time, that's when they would typically do their individual therapy or a group therapy session or a family session. So, they're with us about an hour and a half uh on a just a typical day. Uh and then they get assessed again before they leave and then they go either if they go to work, they can go to their work, they're a stay-at-home mom or a parent
or someone who goes or if they're in a sober living, they can return to their sober sober living and do whatever their sober living asks of them and then come back the next day. So, so they they need to come see you every day. Every day. That's that's that's by design. So, medically they're they're monitored and we we have 24hour access to us. If they have a medical emergency after hours, they are encouraged to call. You know, if they have if it's a major emergency, we're going to say call 911 now. But if it's something that we can manage over the phone that's not an emergency, we'll talk with them and try to get them from that point to their next appointment the following day. Yeah.
And when do they uh make it to you? Do you see you see them every day? Um or are you working primarily with just the the ladies?
Oh, no. I work with with men and women.
Um so, everyone in our care has an individual session once a week. like that's a minimum right minimum requirement. Um we do offer group sessions daily. [snorts] Um so it can vary a little bit. You know there may be
some days where somebody says I've already done therapy and two groups this week and I need to get to work and they do at least need to sit be observed after their medication and have a conversation. But as far as seeing me um that's not necessarily every single day.
Um, I really, you know, when he was talking, I thought about, you know, we do want to bridge this into something, um, either longer term treatment or just lifestyle changes. And I really enjoy the groups as a way to do that. I, you know, I love doing individual therapy with people and letting them really get out. Some of them do have these old traumas we talked about, which yeah, they're only with us for a couple of weeks. So, they do need to go on to get more help with that somewhere else.
But the groups are such a wonderful way to introduce these lifestyle changes.
Like I like to tell them cuz so many people who experience addiction are really very introspective people. Like you know, their ways of thinking, their ways of looking at what they've been through might be a little off right now, but they've spent a lot of time thinking. And so I like to tell
them that you can't think yourself into a new way of living, but you can live yourself into a new way of thinking. Oh, I need to write that down.
We we need to like you said like like get your feet moving. Like decide how you're going to do this. Are you going to get into 12step recovery? Are you going to get involved in your church?
You're going to start working out. Like we need to put all these habits in place because that's how you're going to change your life. That's how you're going to get to a point where you don't need to change the way you feel with substances all the time.
I love that you view it that way. like that um you're you're it's not that you're just pushing one like this is the way, you know what I mean?
I love that.
Yeah, I do think that there's more than one path to recovery. I know what worked for me and I'm always happy to share that with people. Um but I do think that, you know, we're we're not all the same, right? Um certain things that worked really well for me might might not for you. And um as I referenced earlier um it might have been before we started the podcast. I also love like a layered approach. You know, let's not pick one thing and devote our whole lives to it because as addicts, we can take anything too far.
Oh yeah. [laughter] As closest to the edge as I can get without anybody finding out. [laughter] So let's talk a little bit about um one of the notes that I have here in front of me is is the bridge, not a flyover. Reclaiming detox is a beginning way.
What is what does that mean for you guys? Explain that. Basically, we're trying to get that we're not just going to offer medication and and have you
come in, here's your meds, see you later, you know, we're trying to create an excitement and education around recovery as a way of living. So that hence all the things that we offer uh the therapy uh the introduction if if they've never been introduced and we had a young lady who had never had had such little experience with any kind of recovery and she was sitting in our lounge two or three days in reading the big book uh which isn't the only way but it's a way and it's a real effective way and uh she she found an interest in it quickly and ended up she was from a rural area started doing online meetings regularly and and got excited and and it's been really effective for her. So that's fantastic.
Yeah. So just having conversations, recovery conversations with these folks uh in addition to the therapy. Uh we hope that that we excite them about recovery. That's right. Like it is possible for your life to change and for you to not be uh you know consumed with the idea need for a substance to change your life to heal. what's or to treat what's going on inside of you.
I I I [clears throat] get excited about that, too. And people, they often want to measure how fast things happen and how quickly it should happen and, you know, blah blah blah.
Um I'm glad that the things that are happening for me now as I walk through different doors than I did in year one. I I couldn't have handled it. Yeah.
You know what I mean? Like, and so just be thankful for the things that we are given. And it was it was hard in the beginning, but um
it it just happened the way it's supposed to. the the doors, you know, they got bigger and bigger and bigger, you know, I mean, which is great. I I did hear you kind of mention um they're
there with you guys or doing this for a couple of weeks. How how long are they with you?
So, it it can vary based on on the person and their needs. Uh what what substance they've been using, what their detoxification plan needs to look like.
So, that that's really based on their medical needs when when they come in.
Um so, you know, it can be 2 weeks, it could be four weeks. Um, but it's it is a outpatient detox. So, nobody's going
to be there for a very extended period, which is why we do want to, as we said, make this a bridge into into something
else. Um, I think that a lot of people who are new to this or not even new and just haven't gotten very far with it
think that coming to a treatment center is like, "Oh, I'm going to come here every day for 2 weeks and y'all are going to fix me," you know, or even family members who
think that, you know, that like, "Is this one going to work?" You know, we've been before. Is this place going to work? And and we have to,
you know, remind them that this is this is a marathon, not a sprint, right?
And you can't buy soiety. Mm- And you they have to want it. So, you mentioned families. Are you guys uh you do you allow family to come sit in the
room with you as part of the plan?
We'll do um family therapy sessions as part of the plan. Yeah. We want them there. Yes.
We need them there. They if they're if they're if they have that Well, first of all, they need someone supportive outside of in, you know, somewhere in or
around their life because, [clears throat] you know, our model works best when there are supportive people uh outside of our
facility. We need that the families offer up the a lot of times the other perspective and and
a lot of times the truth that we're not able to bring into the session that the family can round up like hold on this is
what that really looks like cuz Johnny or Susie is you very diluted in their thinking about what the past five years
have looked like and mom dad or spouse says hold on he don't have a clue because he's been the one drunk. We're
the ones who have felt and seen and experienced all these things. So, we want them there. We want to bring them in so we can kind of start clearing the
air of what's really been going on and break through the delusion uh that that a lot of us come in with that it hasn't been that bad or I haven't really hurt
anybody but myself. And they're we want them a part of it. with having families come in, are they um
do most families that do come in, are they coming in there, are they coming in hot? Like it's got to be a guarded conversation cuz I can tell you Debbie
Kennedy, my little 4 foot mom, when she if she were to come in a room two weeks in after me trying to find somebody, she
she's bringing a picture of the jail report. Remember this? Remember this?
Let's talk about this today. You know what I mean? Or hey, remember that DUI helped you pay for? So, not everybody's going to come in there with the mindset of, you know, support. Yeah. Or enablement.
How do you guys help them and and and lead through a conversation?
The first call is almost always that opportunity to get the family's perspective. And that's when they can really let loose and vent if they need
that. And for me, it's more information gathering of what's the the experience been. Tell me the significant events and
all that where where Miss Debbie could have said this my son he did this and she was ready to punch but she was
good and and and that's the stuff we want.
She sent my jail report picture with a red star on it like I was a celebrity. Oh wow. Look at what you did. Welcome.
[laughter] Look this what we're dealing with back at home. Here's your pack of camels. you know, right?
So, not I mean, I just but she she's so proud of me now, but you know, in the beginning, um it just I just feel like people need to hear that because part of the the the thing
that you guys um that I want to talk about, too, is um and I love this because it's it's in my book, too, is being a generational breaker, not a generational blamer. You know what I
mean? And and I know for parents um and I'm thinking about my parents now, is that that's got to be heavy. you know, cuz
uh how how different would their life have been if I hadn't had an addiction?
Like what would it have done to the family if if I hadn't? So, you guys have genu generational chain breaking. Um is
that a part of the conversation that you that you have with uh maybe the children, the parents, and the spouses when they come to you guys?
I think it kind of depends on who you're talking to how that comes up, right? I think that um oftentimes
that conversation has been central to a a client because they're concerned about their own children, even if they don't
have children yet, but about doing that next. And and just to kind of go back to what you were saying about parents or spouses coming in and being
very angry, I think Brandon said, they have that kind of opportunity to vent and to give us this information and get all that out. And we do if we're sitting
together in a session with a parent and child or a married couple um you know you do want to make sure
that that stays centered on something positive.
You know what I like to tell people is that um you have the right to be angry but you don't have the right to be cruel. Right? If our anger is getting in
the way of us moving forward in a productive way um we can work on that.
Right? we can work on that and and reminding them that you have been through something very difficult too, like they're in crisis right now, but but maybe you are as well and and maybe
we need to talk about what resources are going to be good for you because I think that they they get lost in that.
Um it's easy to get overwhelmed with somebody who is in the throws of addiction and for them to become the center of everything.
That's a big thing. That's a big thing for everybody to walk through. Yeah, the kids, the the spouses, a lot of them um I've had the opportunity to connect
with a lot of married couples just trying to get into this ministry or this work of, you know, recovery vow and and and not for not forgetting the supporting spouse of someone.
And we're taught healthy selfishness and I've talked about this before on this podcast or in the book and things like that, but um the spouses,
they come in, you know, hurt. um they come in um well all this attention is on them you know or you know what
about me you know and so in that in that conversation you got you both have said this is that uh if they don't get everything out then do they have the
opportunity to talk about things later on with you and then what what resources do you offer families um as they you
know as they kind of become a part of what you're doing with with whoever they're you're working with does that make sense I know I said a lot of words I just know yeah the the goal would to
you. They're only with us again for anywhere from you think about 7 to 21 days, sometimes 28. And that's just a
big general uh I guess estimation. Uh we want to point them towards their own therapy. Want to point them point them
towards their own recovery groups, Alanine, Accelerate Recovery, uh PAL, parents of addicted, what is it? Parents of addicted loved ones, I believe.
I think so. I've I've spoken at one of those meetings before. Um, uh, families anonymous. That's another good one.
That's that's often recovery val.
Recovery. Absolutely. Get into the recovery valve. The collective. The collective. Uh, the the checkpoint.
Yeah. All the just have to mention it. Absolutely.
This is just a resource like we were saying earlier, wherever we can come alongside of you guys, we want to be of service to you too. And what we see happen, what I've seen over my years,
decade, over a decade of working in the field is that sometimes often the family
being in their own recovery first will speed up the process for the person, the addict or the alcoholic for
getting sober. It's not a guarantee, but I've watched it with my own eyes countless times where mom, dad, spouse starts to get better, learns how to say
no, learns how to set boundaries, learns how to communicate effectively, learns how to disengage and and detach with love. And and it makes it it gets louder
for us to go, "Oh, wow. this has to change because they're done kind of
screwing with my uh behavior and my my you know all the stuff that's tor you know in some ways terrorizing torching torturing my family. Yeah.
So, but for us we're going to point them towards their own therapy after they're done with us.
Do you guys have a process where you want to hear from them after a certain amount of time goes by? Like a check-in maybe six months or a year?
Yes. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, we we've got uh uh what what are increments? 90-day follow-ups, six month follow-ups, and
then we'll just also reach out to the alumni and see how they're doing just randomly, too, just to check in and see what's going on because
uh if if they need additional support, we want to be able to offer that to them.
Yeah. What's a healthy number of of um like your sweet spot right now? How many people are you working with? And is that are you at a place where you take on
more or is that that's just a good number? Like are you working with 20 people?
I would say the a a perfect or kind of a a sweet spot for us would be probably six to eight, six to 10. 10 would be the top with how we're staffed right now.
We're small. It's small. It's by design.
It's intimate. So if we start I think that's really good because then you care about the person, not a number, right? Yeah. Yeah. We we don't a big
goal of ours and is that our staff our team is is healthy and if you start overloading the team
with more than what we can handle I think it it starts to show up in client care and and we don't want that. So, uh,
yeah, 6 8 10 and we're we're hiring definitely hiring more people at that point cuz cuz it's a lot one, you know,
one or two people can can create a lot of work, much less six, eight. And not this negative work, but just work. We're complicated. We are not easy people to
treat and and and love and support. Uh, and we got a whole team of people that that love
working with our population. Uh, I I feel very blessed with who God placed on this team because it's to have so many people like-minded and
with an honest desire to to help and love. It's it's cool. Yeah. It's not about a paycheck. So cool.
Yeah. It's not about a paycheck. It's um it's how we 12step if people go through a 12step process or just like again how we stay sober. It's
I love doing this work. Now, I'll say this. Do I get down in the grind of it? I go back to the same kind of number.
like I'll sponsor or work with a certain amount of guys, but it's maybe like two or three at a time. And because more than that, I'm not going to give you you
only go in a certain amount of directions 100% before you start failing. You know what I mean? Absolutely.
And so, um, but with this where, you know, we're just casting vision, if you will, or sharing things or creating things uh that's supplemental that go along with each thing.
That's that's what I really enjoy, too.
And it's helping somebody rewrite what their legacy looks like, you know, because our legacies are now different.
You may have found out you were going to have baby number three in treatment, but look at your life now.
And you may have almost chewed your bottom lip off. [laughter] Look at what you're doing now. And and I did not hurt my child in a car wreck, but look at us
now. And so we can sit here and share stories like we're sharing.
And and we're helping people whether they make it to Southern Pines or Recovery B. Yeah, that's right.
They got to hear from us today. And that's that's what makes us superstars.
That's why we get the red star around our face now. That's right.
Because we got the DUI [laughter] DUI at Taco Bell. Well, I got a DUI at Taco Bell drive-thru. That's how I got that.
Great. Yeah. And then I went back the next day when I got out and got the burrito that fell [laughter] asleep. Yeah. Supposed to get
um what would be before we land the plane? Um what's something that uh from a personal standpoint or from Southern
Pines would you want people to hear today? Maybe it's a word of uh encouragement. Don't hesitate if if
[snorts] there is an idea or some level of willingness, a possible consideration
that something needs to be done, make the move, make the call somewhere to someone to get moving on recovery and
that it's possible. The darkest of the darkest situations can generate the most incredible lives. uh and that that not
pursuing recovery could rob not only them but others uh of of a a change in life that is beyond anything they could have ever imagined.
That's good. It's almost like the power of an invite. Marty said that today from stage he's like you just never know the power of an invite. Somebody may hear this. Wow.
And it's just that power of your invite.
And if they do want to connect with you guys through your invitation just now, they can go to info@ southernpinesreovery.com. They can do that. That's an email.
Yep.
That's how old I am. I'm 47. I just read a website is an email.
They can email that [clears throat] and and to us and we will get that or southern pines recovery.com or uh 706 5342567.
Uh they can call that and we'll and that's 24/7.
Yes, they can call now. Yeah. Yeah. The the the emergency folks who are in our care uh will answer that call. If it's
a.m., we may not be able to get back to them till till about 7 on the admission call, 7 or 8, but we're going we're going to do our best to get to them quickly.
And we also have a Facebook page that you can direct message and you know the kids geriatrics like me. Do you have an Instagram too?
I do. But you know some of the kids they don't I'm in for Southern Right. Okay.
Oh, we're working on Instagram. We don't have Instagram.
Um but they they don't they something about picking up the phone can feel really scary to people. But we do we have an email. You can direct message us from that um that Facebook. Um that's good.
You know, when it feels scary to talk to somebody.
Yeah. And um that's that's good that you're getting uh Instagram, too, because there is a different generation.
Like we we're trying to reach all kinds of generations. Well, some of them are going to find us through they're going to go to Instagram. Yeah.
Maybe we all need to get on Tik Tok, too. I got Tik Tok. You have Tik Tok?
I just copy and paste whatever we put there. It just because you can't it doesn't transfer or share whatever. and and I'm so cool.
I'm a distracted [clears throat] individual. I don't I don't personally need any more than what I already got. Facebook alone is distracting for me.
But thank God we have other people who handle that and let them do it. Think younger and let them do it. You know what I mean?
Same thing for you, Emily. If you wanted to leave um a powerful word of wisdom, encouragement, or something from Southern Pines Recovery, what would you
tell maybe a a lady that's going to treatment soon or needs to go to treatment soon? I know it might seem cliche, but I I do think it's so
important probably especially for women um in recovery to remember that you're not alone. You're not the only one who's ever gotten yourself into this
situation. You're not, you know, terminally unique is is the phrase we use sometimes because I think especially
as women in addiction sometimes we can we can feel like, you know, how how did we get this
screwed up? you know, um I that perfectionist thing that so many young women have kind of gone off the wrong
direction. And I would just encourage them to, like I said, remember that they're not alone and that we have this staff here who
almost all of us have literally been where you are. You know, maybe not exactly, maybe not your exact story, but but we know what it's like. We know how
cary it is. We know what the struggle is. And we want to be there. We want to support you. We want to, you know, provide whatever guidance we can. Can I ask you a personal question? Sure.
When you found out you were pregnant with with that baby number three, how old is, how old is that baby now? Is it a boy or a girl? He's seven. He's seven. Yeah, that's sweet. He's seven and a half. Yeah.
He's a handsome little guy, too. He's cute. Cute as he could be.
And your other two, they are 9 and 11. 911. Mhm.
Okay. That's awesome. Do you We got a daughter kid, you asking? Yeah.
Yep. She's six going on seven. And we have a little boy who is due in less than two weeks.
Miracle lot of lot of miscarriages, a lot of losses. And uh and he's he's the
you were on this podcast like 10 months ago. So I'm just saying. [laughter] Yeah.
Yep. We were in the process of of trying to to create this little fella uh with God and and Yep. Little Becket James
Scarbor will be here. Yep. scheduled. I don't know when this will air, so I don't know if I should say the date, but um he'll probably he may be a month old.
Yeah, sometime. [laughter] Yeah. [clears throat] So, well, I just I bring that up because I want you guys to think about your kids right now. Just that's the decisions you
made have changed their lives.
Absolutely. That and so we often think about the lives of people that we change because of our addiction. Look, look at the lives you change because you chose recovery. That's right.
Yep. That's good.
That's right. Um, hey Emily, Brandon, thank y'all for coming all the way from Augusta, Georgia over here to Evans [laughter] to to do this
um podcast, but I'd love to have you guys.
I live in Appling, so it kind of was a hole. [laughter] Do we need to get you an Uber back home or I mean you'll be able to drive?
I don't think we said where we were. We are in Evans. Southern Pines in Evans. I forgot to mention that. We are in Evans.
So 723 industrial, but people like like I asked in the beginning, people from this area can can connect with you guys, but you guys will work with folks that are an hour away.
Oh yeah, absolutely. As long as they want to make the drive. Yeah.
But you prefer for them to come. Nothing virtual, right? They need to come be in pres they have to have their physical
presence. Their body needs to be in our facility every day. Yeah, that's good.
Um as we close, um tell us what afterare looks like.
Right. So, we do have um a case manager on staff and you know, I talk to them about it in therapy and groups and then the case manager is able to really sit
with them and and make a plan. Um again, I have all these catchphrases I like to use and everyone everyone knows this
one, but it's if you fail to plan, then you plan to fail.
So, we want everybody to really have a plan put together. Are you going to go to an IOP from here? Are you can we go ahead and get you set up with a a
therapist to continue seeing once a week? Are you going to be committed to 90 meetings in 90 days in some kind of 12step recovery place? You know, we
really want to [snorts] make a a full plan for them hopefully to commit to so they'll be, you know, set up for long-term success.
Hey, thanks for joining me on the Recovery Val podcast today. I want you to do me a favor. Go to Recovery Val YouTube channel, click subscribe. You
can go back and watch any episode you want to watch. Today was a very good episode and I hope that you learned something from it. I hope you enjoyed it and I'll see you next week.