How OCD Lead to Addiction: Wade and Helen's Story | Recovery Vow Podcast

In this powerful episode of The Recovery Vow Podcast, Wade and Helen share their journey from college life at Ole Miss to building a marriage and family while navigating the challenges of alcoholism. Helen opens up about her early struggles with anxiety and OCD, her first encounters with alcohol, and the path that eventually led her into sobriety. Together, Wade and Helen talk about the impact addiction had on their marriage, the turning points that brought them to recovery, and the role of faith, family, and community in rebuilding their lives. Their story is raw, real, and filled with hope for anyone walking through addiction or standing beside a loved one who is struggling.

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• Transcript

  Hey, thanks for joining us on the Recovery About podcast. On today's episode, I'm sitting with Miss Helen and Mr. Wade, and they're going to give us a peek inside of college life, Old Miss, Hanks down in Charleston, and then just falling in love and get married. But then they're going to give us a little uh peak inside of what uh alcoholism looks like inside of a marriage and then the growth of their family and then the growth of of their love for each other. and um one who can just put it down and walk away and one that just says I'll do the same thing. So, uh I think uh listeners and and you guys that are watching, you will um relate to this across the whole country. There there's going to be people that listen to this podcast today and it's going to touch home. So, sit back and enjoy. All right, Wade and Miss Helen, we're going to just keep the conversation going. And we were already talking before Cameron hit the the record button. So, let's just keep going with that. I I was telling you or trying to walk you through what today's going to look like. We're going to spend an hour together. It's going to be great. It's going to be fantastic. Wade, you said you mumble, but you won't mumble through this. This is your story. So, you got this. But, uh, I do want to say that I'm so glad that we finally made this happen. Um, I've been wanting you guys to come on the podcast for a long time. you are huge influencers uh I feel like in in our city and um and you have the ability to change a lot of people through your story and so I know that's part of your goal. Um but let's just let's just dig right in. What um Miss Helen, what was life like for you? I was thinking about it earlier today. You know, my there's two early memories uh that I have. One of them being I remember being six years old and the first time that I watched Dumbo. And if you remember Dumbo's mom when she's in jail that she sticks her trunk out and picks Dumbo up in her arm or in her trunk and is rocking him back and forth. And I remember just crying at 6 years old thinking, "Oh my gosh, I just want to be a mom." Like that's the only dream I ever had in life was I just want to be a mom. I just from that moment on knew that in every fiber of my being that I wanted to be a mother. And then I remember distinctly in the third grade around the third grade just overwhelming. Now I know it's anxiety. I didn't know what that feeling was was then. Um but it was just a a pending doom like something catastrophic is going to happen. And so the way I started to cope with it was control. A lot of OCD tendencies um even at that early of an age. Yeah. Yeah. But it wasn't to where, you know, my parents, you know, they probably were not aware. I mean, but it was just crippling. Um I had to do everything a certain number of times. Um I was terrified of throwing up. And so I had convinced Yeah. What is it about? Weird. I don't know. I used to cry when I was a kid. If I threw up. Yeah. I'd be just like And so I convinced myself that I did if I did something in a certain order or if I did something a certain number of times, then I wouldn't throw up. And so it was that's really where I think it started. And I didn't know what to do with that. And I had a lot of intrusive thoughts I think from that. And they just I believed it, you know. I believed um I think that was my first encounter with spiritual warfare and my brain accepted what or my heart accepted what my brain was hearing. Do you have siblings? I have two older brothers. Did they have any of those OCD type? No, just you. I mean, we are type A people or my oldest brother and I are type A people. I mean, we like to be in control and we like things to be in a particular order, but you know, my my dad is like that, too. But, but I don't I don't think that it was like it took me until years to even look back to even see that, right? But I it's like I knew something was wrong with me. Yeah. I just didn't know what. And I I I certainly wasn't going to speak it out loud. Um, and so it just sort of manifest like just continued to grow and I just continued to be controlled by it. And so I think I've always heard voices in my head um and as I got older I if I knew that if I didn't do what what what I heard um then I just hated myself even more. Mh. Um, and so that's really where it started and it just Do parents ever see that in you? Did like that type A, that OCD? And yeah, but they think, you know, I mean, it's funny to a point where it's, you know, they didn't see the counting and you know, I hate odd numbers and so I could not let anything be on an odd number. Like anything digital you will never see on. I'm the same way. You talking about the volume on the TV or something like that? It has to be a 20, 22, 24. 25. Are you okay with fives? No. Okay. See, I have to pay with fives. I'm not. It's a It's an even number thing. I thought it was just me. I bought a car um probably I don't know 10 years ago. It was the Infinity SUV thing. And the guy I bought it from, he would count the steps going up the stairs. He had it so bad. And if he got to the top step, he would kick his like the toe of the step to make sure he he hit an even number going up. Yeah. And he when he was coming down, he would hit it with the heel of his foot if he didn't hit a certain number. I completely relate to that. I'm sure he So, I knew it was going to be a good car. Yeah. Yeah. You know, well, and I think he'll, you know, once we got married, we'll probably get into like some of my clean, you know. Um, Miss definitely took over with that because I was then I'm a germaphobe, right? And it's like I just thought this is what I was. Um, I wish my wife was here. She's just saying, "Kristen, are you going to watch this?" Yeah. So, that continued through high school and I, you know, I just always, um, I knew something I just kne I just knew something was wrong with me. I just never knew what it was. Um, and so that turned into a lot of inadequacy. Um, I can't measure up. I'm not pretty enough. I'm not thin enough. I'm not I'm just not enough. Um, and so the f, you know, the I think after the first drink I had, it was just, you know, at 14 was like 14. I was going to ask you how old 14. And it was just, you know, well, where has this been all my life? You know, like it finally made the noise between my ears stop. And for people that are listening, they'll know then that you can land on the 21, the 23, or the 27, whatever the ball. I'm saying that to relate like it takes away that anxiety. Well, even today, I turned the thermostat when we were leaving on 73 because now I'm able to do that because I'm you know, it's like it's not that deep. Something catastrophic isn't going to happen um because I left it on an odd number. Yeah. Um, so I believed that and believed a lot of the the lies that um, you know, that I heard in my head. I mean, today I know what they are. They're my character defects, but um, and so I think it just goes back to the spiritual warfare. Um, where'd you take that first drink at when you were 14? You remember them at home? Like going out of the house, took a bottle of vodka with a friend. Yeah. I mean, yeah. just, you know, I think my parents, it was their vodka bottles were all water for a long time. Um, and so, you know, I mean, I drank all through high school and was just wild. I just was wild. Any the fastest way to get me to do something is tell me not to do it. Yeah. Yeah. Um, and so, you know, I graduated from high school and what do I I went to Old Miss. Like, where's the number one party school in the country? because that's where I'm going. You and Old Miss. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. How um so I mean a lot of folks when they come on the podcast we talk about drinking you know when we started and all of them you know land around that 14 15 whatever that age frame and then we do it through high school and college because we think some of us think that you know it's just a part of it and I'll grow out of it eventually whatever. Um, I did. I I thought it just, hey, I'm I'm going to sneak around do this cuz it's what everybody does. What everybody does. But, um, when did you know like was it in college at Old Miss or did you know in high school by chance or do you think it was after both of those that you had a real issue with it? Um, I think there I knew that I had an I can remember fleeting thoughts in college of like slave to the drink like you know just thoughts of like you know you I don't know that this is normal but then it was like I mean who cares like I let's start all over. Y um but never was it like I'm going to try to stop. Um cuz you know at that point I'm like really into wine and so like I'm doing Oh yeah. So like I've got bottles under my bed and in my closet and you know got this notebook because now I'm learning about wine and it's totally acceptable. Um but it's weird this under your bed. Yeah. Yeah. I had it everywhere. Yeah. But I was letting it age, right? But it never lasted. Yeah. Never let it sit there any length of time. Right. Cuz then it had to breathe. Right. And then you just had to be there for the breathing. Exactly. So, and then when I graduated from college, I mean, that was the one thing is I knew that if I I did enough in college so my parents that so I didn't fail out like that. I didn't have to come home. I did make a D in a that was not fun. I didn't go. I mean, so I did um I did enough to stay out of, you know, Yeah. You still under the radar. Uh yeah, just Yeah. bare minimum. Um I mean, there were times that my parents threatened to bring me home. I mean, they they knew something wasn't Yeah. Right. But at the same time, it's like, well, I mean, she only has a year left or whatever it was. and I was working in the restaurant business and I made my, you know, made my own money. It was And you that that's kind of what we were talking about before we started, you know, recording is it's hard for and I'll talk to the parents. It's hard for parents to understand the balance. Your parents were trying to let you figure out how to be a young adult kind of going out on your own. Yes. Before they step back in and be mom and dad again. And but they don't want you to go that wrong route, right? you know, um they want you to figure it out, but then then they have to set back in and help you get back on track or they feel like they have to. Well, and they Yes. And they did. I mean, I I certainly looking back on it now, I mean, that's a harsh decision to say, "You're coming home, you know, we're done." And um you know that when they they got the letter that I'd been kicked out of my sorority um that was you know I was like well I mean I just you know it was just it was you know it's I had some story for it. What was the reason? Drugs and alcohol. Okay. So it's like a big no no in the sority. Mhm. Okay. Yeah. And I have made amends to the sorority and you know part of that amends was you made the right decision by doing that. You had every right to do that and um you know now there's a painting with a with a letter on the back in that sorority house that talks about was my amends to the sorority and you know I'm always available to anybody that ever needs help. That's amazing. Um, so I'm really grateful for that because I carried that ball and chain around with a lot of shame and guilt for a long time. Um, so I graduated from college and then moved to Charleston. Did you and Mr. Wade know each other at this time? Not yet. No, we had gotten to the good parts yet. So I moved to Charleston uh to start my career in food and beverage. And at the time, you know, my dad was did not want me to go to Charleston. um you know he in it it wasn't an argumentative way he just said you need to move home you need to get you know just pull yourself together and then I'll help you move but and I said well I don't I I want to go now and he said well okay if you go I'm going to sell your car like you're not I'm not you're not going to I'm not supporting you at all like you're completely cut off but it's your decision and I was just handed him my keys and was like okay and so I moved and yeah without a car and lived in downtown Charleston and Uber wasn't around then. Yeah. I I walked everywhere. Yeah. Okay. So, I started working at um a fine dining restaurant. The other the general manager at the time had graduated from Old Miss and so somebody had connected us and so I started working there and worked, you know, for several several years and was promoted and um was eventually one of the co-general managers and of course was the wine buyer. And so the other manager hired Wade. He had come to Charleston to go to the Citadel for graduate school. Okay. Yeah. So that's how we met within that restaurant. Now, did Wade when you first met Helen, did you have any idea that that there could have been an issue going on or you guys were just having a good time? Yeah, we were just having a good time. In fact, I don't know if I would say I moved to Charleston to go to the Citadel. I moved to Charleston first. I was kind of like, you know, freewheeling. Yeah. Post uh undergrad. I've worked for a year um in North Carolina at a therapeutic facility for at risk adolescent boys and in like a wilderness setting. And so that's where I kind of um developed working with young people. And uh but it was a tough gig and I wanted to I wanted to do something a little bit more uh secure. So uh education was kind of calling me back. So um but I I didn't have any strings attached. So I I've never lived near the ocean before. So I'm going to make my way down there. I had some friends and and Charleston's awesome. Charleston's awesome. Yeah. Great time. And so uh um the city had a educational program for for teaching for teachers and uh so uh I moved down there. I didn't have a job. Um Do you have a car? I had a car. Boom. Already a winner. Had a Jeep. Yeah. And um so I I moved down there. I lived on a um friend of mine let me borrow his couch for until I could find a job. And um uh I think I worked for maybe a month or two uh before you in the restaurant in a in a burrito joint while washing dishes. Wait, that was his restaurant experience. That was my restaurant experience going to like a fine dining. Yeah. And so, um, so I go from washing dishes in the back to, you know, uh, t tablecloth, white tablecloth restaurant. She's trying to fire me. I don't remember that cuz I hadn't like I I was, you know, I was pretty rough raw. Yeah. In the restaurant. So green. Um, and so she's like breathing down my neck. And so give me an example. Give me a uh give me a a bird's eye view of this restaurant. You did you say it was Hanks? Hanks Seafood. Yes. It's fine dininging restaurant in Charleston. That's still there. Yeah. And um and you were the manager? Yeah. The one of the general managers. Yep. And Young Wade. Young comes out of kitchen out into the field of restaurant. Berber assistant. Yeah. And and Helen gives you a hard time. Oh yeah. Now, did you um did did you know who she was? Was there like an attraction like crush or that was older than I was? Well, um wait, that's not how we want to start this conversation. Well, yeah. Well, I went up to him. I remember it was I was standing at the bar and the bartender was um one of my super close friends. And I remember looking at her and saying, "When did Wade When did Wade get hot? Like, who is this?" And she said, "Hell, he's worked here for like three months." I said, "Really? And so I looked at him and I said, he walked up to the bar. I said, "Wade, that scar on your face." I was like, "That really works for you." And he just looked at me and walked in the opposite direction. I was like, "Man, that did not go well." But that kind of started it. And then we, you know, I think we went out for a drink a couple nights later and he told me he didn't date older women. And I said, "Well, how old do you think I am?" And he said, "I don't know, 28, 29." I said, "I'm 23." And how old was he at the time? 25. Yeah, he did. So you're older. Yeah. So, but fast for I mean, but it didn't take It's not like a big huge age gap either. It's not like you're a 70 years old. Wait, like I'm not dating you geriatric. Well, I think because I'd been really like not nice, you know? I think he understandably so had his guard up. But that's the anxiety and the OCD colliding with the alcohol. Oh. Of just what are you doing? Yeah. Um, so tell me like you guys started dating and Well, I will say that the first couple weeks that we were seeing each other, um, I remember I distinctly remember thinking I've got to clean up my act cuz this is not cute and he is not going to he's not going to stick around for this. Um, yeah. So, that would I would say I like to say that's the first time he probably saved my life is that that was the first person I'd ever met that was like uh-uh. and he made that big of an impact that Oh, yeah. And and it's like you I heard you kind of say in that sentence you wanted to change for him. Yeah. I I didn't Not that you're ready to do anything else for yourself, but you wanted to make a good impression. Yeah. There were there were things that were going on that just somebody, you know, cuz I misery loves company, right? So, I was hanging out with a lot of people that were in the same um phase of life or doing the same things I was doing. And so Wade was the first one that I met that was just like, whoa, this is I got to change a lot of things. Um, and so, you know, over time, you know, he pulled me out of a lot a lot of that. Um, can you give me can you give listeners an example of maybe one of those times? I think you don't have to be it's not to be embarrassing, but just whatever you want to share. I think I can remember, you know, Wade is very calm and I'm not. He seems extremely calm. Yes. And I'm not. And so I think what I can remember is probably letting some of the things that go through my mind out and he just was um grounding in the sense of like you're fine, everything's fine. You know, I can just remember him saying that and I I just believed him and I trusted him and I Wade was the first person that I could ever I felt like myself like I felt how whatever that was. I knew that that feeling of knowing myself and being comfortable in my own skin. I had never felt that ever in my life. um you know and it wasn't long ago I told him I said I would crawl in your skin if you would let me like that is how much this man is my safe space and always has been because it was just I just felt a relief um and so those were some of the ways that I think early on um that's huge I mean that's a that's a that's you knowing that that's your your person is my that's your person I would mountains for for Wait, did you feel the same way? I did. Um I remember we were we were looking at a an apartment for uh a friend of our me and and two other friends were were looking for this apartment. I was like, you know, do you want to go with me and we'll look at it? And um so she went with me and we were kind of like sneaking into the apartment to get a sneak peek. like there were no there was no like owner or realtor or anything. And so we kind of like it was left unlocked. So we like kind of walked in and we run into my she runs into my roommate who he was also there looking at the the apartment and kind of startled him and he's trying to throw her off cuz he thought that she was trying to rent the apartment too. And so then I came around the corner and we because he worked at Hanks too later. Okay. Later. Um and so I remember like uh walking into that apartment feeling this sense of um it just felt good being with her. It was really good. That was the first time just kind of having that feeling. And that love kicking in is what that was. That's right. I love kicking in. Oh yeah. Yeah. I knew really quickly that this was it. So, I can remember telling my mom, we had been seeing each other like two weeks. I said, "Mom, this is it." She's like, "Don't say that. You don't even know him." Oh, yeah. I do, Mom. We went to apartments already, right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, so wait, I'm I want to ask you like, did you have any inclination? Well, I guess Helen, I go back to you. Did you have um because of Hanks, you said you you mentioned you were drinking, so I wanted to ask way, did you have an idea that there was an issue there? Uh, no. Um, just a party girl. Yeah. I mean, we had fun. We had a good time together. Drink it or not. Um, and um, yeah, we just it I never saw it as an issue for her. Um, do you remember the first time you did see it as an issue after college or after Hanks? Um, we were drinking buddies. We were drinking buddies. Um I can't recall. I mean to her it was an issue. Um but there were you know times where you know didn't want to get up or uh you know want to stay stay inside or didn't want to go somewhere but or I couldn't make it through dinner without being like blacked out. I want to go home. Yeah. Yeah. There was that. you remember those frog leg issues you had at dinner last night? And she's like, I don't remember any. We're like going the first night of our honeymoon. The next day he was like, come over here. And he said, put the shoes on that you had on last night. And I went over to the window. He was like, and he he showed where my forehead my face print like this, you know, on this glass where I had completely walked in to the glass and like left a, you know, some sort of mark on there. Make a mark. Yeah. But it's like, you know, you're It's funny. Yeah. It had become like a problem yet, right? You could kind of see it unfolding. I guess I could a lot of it is just it's just internal, you know, that there was I was just on this wheel that I just couldn't get couldn't get off of. Yeah. Um, do you feel So the reason I asked Wade that is, you know, if he didn't see it or didn't know it, you saw it and you knew it that it was something that you were just trying to Yeah. I think it was um I can remember telling Wade like I just you tell me not to drink because if you tell me not to drink I won't drink. And he was like why would I tell you that? Like I'm not going to tell you that. If you don't want to drink just don't drink. And I was like how do you do that? I don't know how to do that. Um, and it was so much of my identity of, yeah, I' always been a party girl. Like, like I'm down for whatever. And so, it it was who am I when I'm not that? I mean, how do I go on vacation? How do I how do you go through Christmas? How do you mingle? How do you have friends? Somebody because, you know, like I'm over here like spun out all the time with anxiety. Um, so and you just didn't want them to see you as that person, that anxious person, cuz I don't remember being anxious when I was drinking. I didn't I didn't battle with any of that. I think we mentioned that a minute ago, but but when I'm not like, if I had if I didn't have it, oh, I was Yeah. eager and and anxious. Yeah. I mean, and you know, I went through some of the things in in high school and with an eating disorder and just, you know, I was just trying to control anything. Um, you know, the last three women that's been on this podcast, everyone every one of them has had um that's part been part of their recovery is an eating disorder. Yeah. It's vicious. Is it? Wow. Yeah. You think it was bigger than the alcohol? It's up there. Yeah. Yeah. It's just interesting that it's come up a battle. Yeah. It's just It's just interesting that that's come up three times. Yeah. the lady that that left here a minute ago, she had a an issue and and I know she wouldn't mind saying it because she was on a podcast and she shared it, but uh she lost 250 pounds, I think. And um and it became like such an addiction to losing the weight, keeping it off, I think, is the way I heard her. Um and then a friend of mine, Miss Louisa Martin, Yeah. Yeah. She was on a couple weeks back and she she dealt with the same thing. And um wonderful family, her and John. And I just I didn't expect to hear that, but it was it was it went hand in hand, she said. That's why I definitely goes hand in hand. Um how far a after um after the restaurant business and you guys apartment shopped? You know, when did you guys get married? We just celebrated our 20th wedding anniversary last Wednesday. Really? Mhm. Yeah. All right. Do the math request. That was 2005. Mhm. July 16th. We just got back from Charleston. We ate at Hanks and uh Did you really? Yeah. Walked around downtown and Yeah. We were in Hilton Head last week. It's so wonderful down there. Yeah. Um so let's talk about that 20 year mark or those 20 years though. Um you know, you moved into a different role, I guess, of work. Yeah. So once we got married, I thought I can't live this lifestyle forever. I mean, my days off were Tuesday and Wednesday. I think I was finally starting to grow up a little bit. Um and so that I completely changed careers and um went into banking. So and that was almost 20 years ago. And so we moved back to Augusta in ' 07 or back home to me. It's but we moved here in bean in 07. Yeah. Well, it was the end of 2006. So it didn't take us long to get out. We needed to get out of there. Um it's just um it's hard to break it's hard to break out of that. Um and so thankfully going into banking there was um it was much more stable daytoday and 9 to5 get up and do it all over again. Yeah. But then it's I keep showing up you know like everywhere I go it's and so then it's the um it comes across as drive like drive to and and and that is it. Um there is a lot of drive there but there's also a lot of anxiety of I have to be number one I have to be this I have to be you know cuz right I'm not com I'm like hor I'm not comfortable in my own skin at all. Um did were you scared to leave Charleston to to come back to Augusta Georgia? Not at all. No I was really homesick. Were you? Okay. And I think that was more of like I've got to get out of here, but I I needed to come home. Good. Yeah. And relationship with mom and dad was good. Even though we kind of took Did he really take your car keys back? Mhm. Sold it. Really? Oh, yeah. Took I had a credit card, took it. Good for you. And it wasn't even Yeah. I mean, and it and it wasn't like it was probably a defiant thing to me, but it was, you know, we weren't yelling or anything. He was just like, "Look, this is these are your choices." is. And I said, "Okay, well, here are my car keys." And he said, "Okay." And then that was it. So, when did you I'm just going to get a little personal with this. Okay. Yeah. When did you guys in this in this last 20 years of marriage, when did you know I know it was probably 5 years ago, but leading up to that, when did you know like, okay, I am I am losing here. I'm losing here a little bit. And then what did that time frame look like? You guys had kids by then. Mhm. Been married for however long. Yeah. Tell me about the hard moment. I knew before probably 2018. I can remember we had I had been on a bender that weekend and going into work that Monday and I How long would your benders last? Like from Friday till Sunday? you know, wasted on Friday night, drank, you know, most of it at least at lunch on Saturday and then Sunday, you know, we would go to church and then get home and um, you know, we I drink beer and then switch you would move to wine. And I just remember being so hung over that next Monday and saying, I I I can't keep doing this. Like, this is miserable. And so I tried to I signed up for this program called one year no beer, which I was only going to do 90 days, right? Like I'm not going to do one year no beer. Where is this program? It's in the UK. Oh, it's in the UK. Yeah. Right. So like I'm being held accountable. So let me find something. Right. So rhymes. Yeah. And well before that though, let me back up. So before that, I remember um there was a book that is they call it quitlit where if it says that if you read it, it's called this naked mind. And it says all over the book like when you're done reading this book, you will not drink alcohol because it's going to tell you how horrible it is for you and what it does to your brain and all of this. And I was like, yeah, I mean health-wise, like yes, this will be great. Why drink vodka the whole time that I read that book? And then I'm like really proud of myself. like girl, you're reading like you have it together. You're reading books like I mean you're fine. And so I read five books during that time period and it was this naked mind um blackout love affair which is a love affair just about a woman's love affair with alcohol and it's her best friend and you know how do you end up in that relationship and then um happier hour and there was a there was another one so like but even during that time that I'm reading these books and like highlighting and you know I'm still not in my mind. Picture you like like curled up in a chair by a window. Yeah. With a glass of vodka and a highlighter. Oh yeah, that was a good one. I was like, "Oh, that's great." Yeah, but I still in my mind I'm not an alcoholic. Like I just drink too much. Um and so I did that and then I did the one year no beer and it was you're it was 90 days. Um and I went 56 and was like I mean well clearly you're not an alcoholic if you can go 56 days without drinking. Like you're fine. Yeah. You had it whipped, right? No problem. And so I went right back to it after 56 days. So none of those books helped at all? No, I just was like, "Yes, I totally relate to that." But no, I mean, it never was like I mean where I didn't want to drink. I mean, wait, did you know about the books and all that? No. Um the in fact the only book I was thinking about was that the million pieces or whatever the opra list. Yes. That was in Charleston though when I read that book and that was about a drug addict. The million little pieces. Yeah. And when I tell you I sobbed when that book was over because I felt like I was losing my friends like Yeah. But it was about a drug addict that um you know ended up going to rehab and there was a sequel. But yeah, that I've forgotten about that one. That was that was the only book I remember reading at the time. But all right, I'm I'm going to ask a loaded question. Yeah. What was um your most not proudest moment? That's probably not a good word way to word that, but tell me the the hardest moment when you knew that, okay, Helen, these books didn't work. You know, I've got to do something. What was what was your what was your rock bottom moment about? Um, well, it says in the big in the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous, it it talks about that your rock bottom is when you're about to lose the one thing you're not willing to lose. And I knew that I was at a point where I either need to go to treatment or I need to go to treatment. I didn't know what else to do. But do you think people can can beat alcoholism without treatment? Do you think people can do it at home? Yeah. I I think there's many ways to get sober. I don't I don't think there's just one. I think what works for somebody, you know, doesn't might not going to the gym. Yeah. Gym right workout. Church babies. I just want you to get sober and however whatever that looks like for you. Um, but it was during COVID and we I was working from home. I had just changed jobs and um because it didn't matter if I was hung over because I'm working from home. Um, it didn't matter what I could start drinking earlier and earlier. And I remember we had this group text at work and I had sent a video of like the disaster that our dining room was, right? Because like our kids stuff is everywhere. And um one of the people in that group texted me individually and he said, "Helen, I can see your liquor drink." And it was like, "Oh." And I was like, "Well, that I mean it's 2:00. It's fine. Like it's fine. Ain't this funny?" And I remember thinking at that point like that that's probably not good. Um and then during that time too, I can remember waking up the next day, I had I couldn't tell you if my children ate dinner the night before. I couldn't tell you if I ate dinner the night before. Um, and our daughter was four at the time and she would come in and I would look at her and it was almost a game with myself where I would say, "These are the pajamas she's going to have on." And it would not it would never be those. And so I would ask her, I would say, "Who bathed you last night?" Like, you know, you must have daddy must have bathed you. No, mama, you did. And it was like, I don't I don't remember. I don't remember anything. And but see, I'm a so I was a blackout drinker, but I just got drunk and went to bed. Like I didn't yell at anybody, didn't hit anybody, you know? So it wasn't this I think I'm not I don't want to speak for you, but I think it was just like you should get drunk and go to bed. Like it's what's the what's the problem, you know? I don't So it wasn't some situation that or I think he was like this has got to stop. Um that that conversation never No, but I can remember cuz you know Wade's outside throwing the baseball with with our boys and he would just set his drink down and then I'd be like, "How do you do that?" So, I'm drinking my drink, drinking his drink, but I'm not hiding it. I said, "I found your drink, so I drank it." And then, you know, because at this point, we're drinking bourbon out of a deca a pretty decer because I don't want to look at the handle to see how fast it's going down. I remember I didn't want to drink wine anymore because I didn't like carrying the bottles in the trash can the next day. Um, you can be cheap like me coming out of the box. Yeah. I mean, it's horrible. I think I did that too at at points in my life. But um so and I think our middle son um he was nine at the time and we fought like cra we fought all the time. Um and so he's a lot like me and I think in in his nine-year-old mind was I'm bored. I go pick a fight with her because she'll always fight back. And so there was just a lot of I think now looking back on it there was just a lot like because I'm I'm just a tyrant at least in my mind. I mean maybe Wade didn't see it that way cuz he's so calm he probably smoothed everything over. But I'm trying to control everybody and everything and this is going to be my way and my our middle son is like I ain't doing it your way sis like I'm not doing it. So always the number two guy. Yeah. So, we've just fought. Um, and God, I can relate to that. Yeah. And our oldest, he was 11 and he has dealt with crippling anxiety throughout his childhood and I remember he came in our bedroom one night. Well, it was the next somehow I woke up and the next day I said, "Why'd you go to daddy's side of the bed?" I said, "Why didn't you?" Cuz he's always gravitated towards me. He said, "Mama, we can't wake you up." And I was and so it was those sort of things that I thought something's not right. And then somebody had referred my good friend and she's fine with me using her name. I've asked her permission, but Kathy Woodruff um referred somebody referred her to me to talk about the paycheck protection loan. And so we get on the phone and it is just a God thing. She saw right through all of it and she twelstep me over the phone and I said, "I'm not going to I'm not going to a meeting. I'm not doing any of that. We're going to the beach next week. I'm not going to not drink. And she said, "That's fine. Call me when you get back." And so I don't, you know, went to the beach and don't remember I don't remember a lot, but I remember I remember that last night and I remember setting that last beer down saying, "I can't do this anymore." at the beach. Mhm. And so that the next day, that was the first day of my sobriety. Really? Mhm. And I went to my first meeting with her two days later. So, you didn't go to treatment? You you just went walked into the rooms. I just walked into the rooms. Yeah. And never left. You know, that's you're the part of that 10% let happen. I mean I mean that I think that's the percentage. It's like 10% walk in and just get it, you know, like just get it without um any kind of a treatment or outpatient, impatient, you know. So, I was desperate to stop. I just was, you know, the one thing I wanted to be my whole life as a mom. I'm really not a good mom. I, you know, I just was I bet you are, though. Maybe now, but I did, I was not at the time. I I was not what I wanted to be for him. I was not what I wanted to be. He deserved more. They deserved more. I And I did, but and so I just had really amazing women that surrounded me um in a 12step program that they just they weren't going to let me fall. That's good. You got to have a good You got to have a good small group around you that that want the same thing for you. Um way, how did you how did you handle that? Like knowing that she's like, "Hey, after this beach trip, that was my last one." Well, I didn't tell him. Oh, you didn't tell. Here we go. I was scared to tell him that I'd gone to a to a to a meeting. I didn't cuz then I have to change. Yeah. Yeah. Um I I didn't know what to think. you know, but obviously if she's struggling, I didn't realize she was struggling struggling that bad. Um, so, um, you know, it was, well, let's kind of kind of what I do is just let's see how things play out. Let's, you know, see, you know, if this thing has legs and um, you know, and then support her however I can best do that. and um and when it got legs and she started um really blossoming um in her recovery and um I say that was July. I think by October I was like you know I don't want I don't want this for me and her like to continue drinking. So at that point I was like, you know, I don't want alcohol to be something um that uh creates a distance between us. And so um at that point I was like um I kind of want what she has. Um and so and uh so that at that point I was like, "Okay, I'm not going to drink anymore either." And um definitely don't want to have it at the house. um just not like reminders um or any kind of um you know if she's taken these steps and she's committed to it um I want to be supportive of of that. So um yeah I was telling him today I remember in October when he said I'm going to stop drinking and I said you don't have to. I was like this is just cuz I'm not drinking doesn't mean you you have to quit. People get so guarded they get so worried like I'm going to make you real like no you're not. Yeah. But no, like it's this is Yeah. This is my gig. Yeah. And um or it's my responsibility to but he I remember him saying you and our marriage is more important to me than alcohol and I'm not going to I don't want you to at one point to look at me and say I don't want to live around it anymore. And so and that was it. And I'm like how do you do that? Yeah. I know. That's what I was thinking and he said I just won't do it anymore. Yeah. He's not an alcoholic. He doesn't have a problem. He was like okay I just won't do it. And I just remember at that point just, you know, being floored that he would do that. Like that's commitment, you know, that's that's living out your vows. I mean, that was just more certainly was more than I deserved. Wade's almost like an anxiety pill. Oh, you I mean just been hanging out with him. He's like, "Well, let's just see if it gets legs. We'll see where this thing goes." And yeah, I'll be right here. Tell him by the way, you're going to be awesome and then when you're awesome, I'm just going to not drink anymore. Right. Yeah. It's like when I found out I was pregnant with our youngest who was a surprise. I'm like crying, freaking out, right? Because it wasn't part of my plan and I didn't want to. Did he say, "Let's see it. Just grow legs and see where it goes." He straight up. He straight up Yeah. He straight up rainbow snapped me and said, "You need to get it together because if the if all of us are inside these walls together, it's all going to be fine." Yeah. Like stop. And that's when I thought, okay, okay, I'm going to try to stop freaking out, but I didn't Rainbow. Just for the record, Wade. Yeah. Gotta love him, right? Well, okay, that's a great story. How has the last five years been? Wow. I remember so I remember when I first came was first trying to get sober and I have an amazing sponsor and I remember you we were working on the steps I remember telling her that with my middle one because we fought all the time. I remember telling her I love him because he's my child but I don't like him. That kid's a jerk. It's okay to say that. Yeah. I said I don't like him. He's a jerk. How old is he now? He is 14. Okay. And she said that's okay Helen. He doesn't like you either. M. And I thought I remember thinking, "What? What are you talking about?" And she said, "You are a dictator and a tyrant in your house and he's so similar to you. How would you feel at 9 years old if somebody was doing that to you?" And it just it just did that to me. Was like a 2x4 across my face. I just She's like, "Look at yourself as a 9-year-old." And that's what he feel. You have taught him all of this. Like this is what he knows is to fight. Because no, I'm not talking fist fighting. Right. No, no, no. I get it. I want to be like I've always Everybody that's got more than one child knows what that second one's capable. Yeah. And even when I was in early in soiety, like he would come by. I remember him walking through the um the laundry room and he had these little shot glasses with water in it and he walked by and I said, "What are you doing?" He said, "I'm drinking vodka." And I took it so like it hurt my feelings, right? Like how dare you? And so I'm like telling my sponsor this thinking she's going to feel sorry for me. She was like, "Does this surprise you? Like this is what this child knows." And it was like like this is what you've taught him. You can't be upset with him about this. Um Oh, but we want to So Oh, yeah. And then my oldest, I told him pretty soon pretty quickly that I was I said, "I'm I'm trying I'm in a 12step program. I'm working on getting sober. I I' I've you know I've got a problem and I just want you to know that I'm working on it. And from then on out he has been really involved in my recovery and ask a lot of questions. And he was in middle school. So he was in the sixth grade at the time and I said when I was making my amends to to them and I said what do you remember? He said I just remember laying awake at night thinking if this house catches on fire how am I going to get her out? I said, "That's what you thought about?" And he said, "Yeah, it's what kept me up at night." I said, 'Well, daddy's in the room. He's like, "What if he wasn't?" I felt like that was on me. Like, I had to I can't wake you up. Um, so that's that's the power of not knowing how much your addiction can um affect your family's mindset. Like that for him is what he worried about. Yeah. And he didn't know it was alcohol. He was too young. But he knew something wasn't right. Right. Um, and so I'm have created this environment for him that's anxious like some what what if what if what if what if something happens? What if he's not here? What if like I have to get everybody out of the house? Um and then he didn't trust you enough for that. No, he knew I wouldn't be able to get me up. Um and then with our middle one, yeah, you know, we just didn't really like each other. Um, and so I've had to do a lot of work, um, and continue to do a lot of work. He's 14, of how would I handle and and somebody in in the rooms too when I shared that story of like how much it hurt me that he's walking through acting like he's drinking vodka, they said, you know, Helen, these kids are going to test you to see if you'll go back to the way it was. Like they're smart and so it's new. So, is this for real or if I push her, is she gonna go back? I mean, it's all subconscious, but and but that helped me understand of how to um not react when he's doing things like that cuz I mean, he's just doing something's different. And so, he's like, I'm just going to go poke to see if she'll react to this. And it's not like that they want to see you fail like let's see if I can get her to go back to the way she was. It's kind of like um it's a jab almost. Yeah. Can I trust this? Yeah. Not cuz you say that it's poke. Mhm. Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, now fast forward and and our daughter, thank goodness, was was too young. Um you know, she was the daughter the surprise. Uhhuh. Okay. Yeah. She didn't really remember a lot of it, but um it was now I mean it it took it it's it's taken time but this is a good example. I was telling somebody the story earlier today. So our middle one is plays baseball and it was a couple years ago. I said you know it's like you have a gremlin inside your head that says that you're not good at baseball. And he stopped and he looked at me and he said how did you know that? I said because I have the same one that tells me I'm fat. M and he said and he just looked at me and I said, "But here's the deal. Mine will eat yours for breakfast, so you've got to let you know, you don't have to listen to it." And that day we went to the baseball field um and before he went up to bat, um still like takes, you know, gives me a minute, but um he put his helmet on the on the chain link fence and he said, "Please take the scribbling out of my head." And I said, "I can take it, but you got to let me have it." M um and so that's from there on has been sort of I'm like don't let that gremlin get kicked up. Um cuz it it's just it's not real, right? And you're using your struggle to help help them. Yeah, that's incredible. Well, and now it was last year he I walked in his room and I said, "Have you seen your grades?" He said, "Yeah, they're not good." And I said, "Do you need me to yell at you about that?" And he said, "No, that makes me not want to do it even more." And I said, "I get that. I'd be the same way. So, what are we going to do about it?" And he's like, "I'll fix it." And he did. And it was like, "Oh my gosh." Like, they're probably going to be world changers. I'm serious. I mean, mine's the same exact way. Yelling does not get anywhere. No. Now, the oldest one, he's scared to death of me. Yeah. But the second one, he could do my taxes, I guess. I don't know. But he has no fear. No, it doesn't care. M so we were in a doctor's office together and he was um we were it so there was a big sign on the stool that said do not sit here physicians only and he looked at me and I said you want to sit on it first or you want me to so we took turns and then I said you feel better he said yeah do you I said I do yeah like you just you got to do it you can't if you tell us not to we're going to do it so it's given us the ability to now I can relate to him and now I can have a relationship ship with him of speaking to a 14-year-old. Yeah. How I would want It's tough. I mean, I thought you were going to say he didn't know what a gremlin was, but the fact that he could come over there and you gave him that opportunity through that um that point of view to that he trust you enough to just lay his head on the fence and you don't get the Yeah. And was like, will you pray for me? Yeah, I get it. You know, Yeah. I mean, so and I think, you know, Wade has always been like the calming one between the two of us. So, um, so our relationship's very different today than it was. We don't, you know, nobody's yelling. There's, you know, not a lot of, you know, it's especially at 14. It's I'm able to look at him when he when he is, I guess, comes at me or, you know, like 14 year olds do. Um, where he is talk whatever the situation is. And today I'm able to look at it and go, these are big feelings. this is not personal about me, but I but I can hold an expectation that, you know, hey, we're we're not gonna talk like this. Like, we can have a conversation and now we can we couldn't do that before, right? And and that's great. I mean, it's not that you're making him feel like he's an adult, but you're giving him like adult decisions he can make. Yeah. And I'm like, "Look, dude, I don't talk to you like that. I don't you're not going to talk to me like that." And he's like I'm like, "But so let's talk about it." Yeah. What are Tell me what's going on in your head where And that's just a different kind of recovery, too. like he didn't know it, but he's in he's in recovery with you. Yeah. You know, I asked my sponsor if I could give him a white chip when he was like nine. She said no. So he maybe he's one of us, maybe he's not. I don't know. But well, I just meant like in the you in assist to where you know the walk around with the shot glass even even maybe for Wade and and other kids like the whole family's in recovery when one parent is in recovery to me because you that's why I asked like it's different than it was before because you guys have made a a decision. Um, ours was a harder decision than Wes because Wade just was put it down like that will change but you know the not recovery from alcohol but just in recovery like the family is and you guys are doing that. Yeah. My good friend George Croft which EK George Yeah. He always says you know we drag these people in the woods with us. We come out first. We have to give them time to find their way out of the woods. Um and that has really helped me. Um, but it's helped us too where you know if we we can respectfully disagree with each other like I don't have to be like do you want to be happy or do you want to be right like and it recovery I think is just at least it's helped me but how we interact with each other when we talk about these things of hearing the other side like I and I want to know what he thinks or what he feels about this different situation. So addiction there's a ripple effect there but there is with recovery too. Absolutely. Mhm. Wade um these last 5 years sounds like it's been really good for Miss Helen and been jam up for you guys too. Yeah. Yeah. Um um outside of from it sir what I've learned from her and her walk um is just how much gratitude um plays a role in um you know how she deals with things and um her happiness and um you know um not try not having to do too much and uh just being thankful for uh where she is and um where she's been and uh you know that kind of thing. Yeah. I I wouldn't change it. Mhm. You know, cuz I wouldn't be, you know, now it said I don't get to just be a mom today. Like I get to be their mom and they're all different. Um but and I they they get to see a healthy a healthy Yeah. It's important to him marriage relationship between you two. This I mean not to say that we you know we don't get in spats or like we all do but but but one of you aren't you know some kids view or see their kid our parents whenever they get in a fight and they leave one's drunk or whatever. So it's you guys are okay. Yeah. Well and um our middle one said too he said you know um we were just some one of his friends was their parents were separating or getting a divorce and he was like you know y'all are just the goat. like y'all y'all are a team and it that meant more you know Mhm. than anything. But I think too just how we um support and there's just for a different level of respect I think for each other um and some of the some there we've been through some things before too where said you know what does the program say about this? He falls back on it. Yeah. I mean like what does the program say because it can be applied to anything. Mhm. Um, that's pretty aggressive. Oh, yeah. Now you can see why I'm I need a bracelet that says www. What would do? What would do? I'm serious. Yeah, I know. Listen, I I want to take time. You and I met at the brunch. Yes. In my brunch. I So, every year, you know, we're nonprofit. Um, I had a brunch and that's where we met. And I think I guess it was from Freda. Uhhuh. And George. Yeah. George had sung your praises. Yeah. Yep. Um so at at the event, you know, we had copies of the book. I want to give you guys a copy of the book because I want Wade for sure to have one. Um and I just want you guys to know that I'm proud of you. I mean, really, you know, a lot of people come on this podcast, they come from all these different backgrounds. Um, you guys came from a a great background and you let us look inside of even coming from a great background and going to Old Miss and all the things and working together and then just falling in love and having kids and a family that that that thing that crept in. You caught it. You worked together as a team and you killed the gremlin uh one day at a time. One day at a time. Yeah. So that was your recovery. that was your vow that you made to yourself and to each other. So, I just think that's great. I mean, you're the perfect definition of what this is all about. Well, and I've read some of the book, too, and that's where I think it's just it's so important to highlight spouses like way that are just, you know, so supportive and whatever you need to do. And, you know, it's I maybe it's not maybe it's not unusual. I think it maybe I was surprised that I have been able to recover because of the support that that he and our children have given me. Um I my third um birthday sober birthday my everybody came and my daughter we came home that afternoon and a neighbor little girl came over and she said where were you earlier and she said I was at an AA meeting. My mom's an alcoholic and so she doesn't drink. And I thought and the little girl was like, "Oh, okay. My mom just doesn't drink." And like off they went and like it was, you know, I just think it's, you think it's going to be this like record scratch off of, you know, where people are just going to look at you like you're Well, it's because we have conversations like this. People are starting to see there's more Helens and more Wads and more Erics out there. And it's it's not like this brown bag behind the scenes. You know, I really think it is. It's cuz we break our anonymity. I know that that's like a kind of forbidden sin. I love breaking my anonymity because it just gives people different points of views, different ways of looking at it. All all of that. Um and I think that just it's just the evolution of recovery. Yeah. you know, smartphones come out, all these tech things come out, and I just really feel like we have to continually talk about recovery, especially in marriages because the wades and the, you know, the spouses out there that some of them get forget forgotten about or they want to forget about you and um yeah, so it's a lot. It is a lot. But I want to say, uh again, thank you guys for coming on the podcast. It takes a lot to come here and sit and just spill the beans. So, way you did Grace. You did great. You did fantastic. Thank you so much. Hey, thanks for joining us on the Recovery Bow podcast today. I want to say thanks to uh Helen and Mr. Wade for being our guests. If you would like to contact us, you can reach us at recoveryvgmail.com or you go to our website at recoverybow.com. We are a nonprofit, so if you'd love to become a donor, we would really appreciate that. If you'd like to follow us on all of our platforms, you can see us on Instagram, Facebook, even Tik Tok. Um, and if you are interested, we have uh Recovery Bow's own coffee line now out of uh Guatemala. We've partnered with a fantastic organization there to help uh those coffee farmers. And if you would like a copy of Marriage After Addiction, you can get it on Amazon or on our website. Hey, thanks for joining us today. We'll see you again next